Activated V6 driver

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 27 Feb 2017, 13:59

The oil leak I mentioned earlier started getting worse during the winter. After cleaning the sump and the surroundings the sump gasket was identified as the culprit. The bolts were pretty loose all around, so I tightened them up a bit. It helped for a while, but the gasket really needed to be replaced. It's a sealant gasket, and I had never done one of those before, so I was a bit nervous going at it. But it seems to be holding oil now. There's also a very slight leak at what looks like the front (foremost) rocker cover. Need to address that next.

Here's a guide that I found helpful on the job: http://www.406coupeclub.org/Files/HowTo ... ngines.pdf But unlike the guide says the oil screen certainly doesn't come off by just pulling on it; there's one of those annoying clic(?) hose clamps on it.

And this document says that threadlocker should be used on the bolts: http://www.autocats.ws/manual/peugeot/4 ... bblsk3.htm It also gives you a pattern for tightening the bolts. I used a drop of CRC Soft Lock which is quite easy to remove, similar to Loctite Blue.

Also the sump itself in the guide looks different from mine... maybe they put the baffles just in the Activa? 8-)


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CitroJim
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by CitroJim » 27 Feb 2017, 14:13

Thanks, I shall make some local enquiries :) I'm sure there will be a 3D printer somewhere here around here...

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 01 Mar 2017, 12:14

Ok, let me know then.

In addition to the forementioned issues the Sensible Daily would probably need new rear suspension arm bearings, as it's making some nasty sounds. And it really needs a new rear bumper, and a new paint job... nearly every panel on the car is dented and/or scratched, or just poorly repaired. I've been thinking of getting a regular mk2 Xantia in the same colour to use as a donor for various body panels, like all four doors...

But for now I think I'll settle for removing the rust from the sills. The sills seem solid, so it's hopefully just surface rust as the paint has been chipped at the jack points.

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HansNOR
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by HansNOR » 09 Mar 2017, 22:47

very nice work. i love how u are rescuing this car.
If u like to share the 3d file for those bracket thingies i'd appreciate one. got 3D printer at work and have been looking for Citroen parts to print :)

Hell Razor5543
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Hell Razor5543 » 09 Mar 2017, 23:33

It makes sense (to me, at least) to put baffles into the sump of an Activa. As it does not lean at all (OK, 0.5 degrees, but that is nothing compared to a normal car) the oil could, for a few moments at least (during spirited cornering), move away from the pickup, which could allow air into the lubrication system or a momentary drop in oil pressure. Baffles would slow down the movement of oil in the sump, keeping it in the area of the pickup.
Last edited by Hell Razor5543 on 10 Mar 2017, 19:06, edited 1 time in total.

elma
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by elma » 10 Mar 2017, 00:13

CitroJim wrote:Thanks, I shall make some local enquiries :) I'm sure there will be a 3D printer somewhere here around here...
I'll print some Jim, I have a few different materials you can try out including a carbon fibre impregnated plastic. Sounds a bit posy but its as tough as it gets really, wears the printer nozzle fast though. Well actually Jon will print them, my friend that came for the V6 with me.

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CitroJim
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by CitroJim » 10 Mar 2017, 10:57

James, that would be excellent :)

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 04 Jan 2018, 15:04

The oil sump gasket job I did last year didn't really hold. I guess the sealant I used wasn't up for the job, as it seems to leak all around now. Any recommendations?

The sump is somewhat scratched and dented, so I sourced another one. When searching for a replacement I found that the sump baffles were present only in the early V6's (at least up to 1998 which mine is), and are of course NFP now. Luckily I found a used one with the baffles.

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 04 Jan 2018, 15:44

As the Finnish government is now supporting flex fuel conversions on older cars*, it's probably a good time to take my E85 plans forward.

While googling the subject I found a French fellow who claims to have driven his 406 V6 (194hv so it must be the ES9J4) on E85 without any modifications. And not just a tank full or two, but 30.000km! The key seems to be to start with 50% E85, then 75% and finally 100% E85. That is supposed to make the ecu learn the fueling. Here's the link to the forum post: http://www.clubcoupe406.net/EuroForums/ ... 039#p64039

I would've thought that that big changes in fuel trims would throw a fault code. And even if the ecu would adjust, the stock injectors (176cc) are too small (at full throttle), so it's not really the perfect solution. I was thinking of getting bigger injectors and a piggy-back flex fuel kit with an ethanol sensor, but maybe it's possible to do this with just the bigger injectors..?

*) You can apply for a 200€ compensation after the conversion is done and the car is inspected and registered as flex fuel. This applies for cars that are first registered before 1.1.2007. E85 fuel is also taxed a lot less than gasoline, making it easier on your wallet. And the ethanol is made out of biowaste, so it makes you a tree-hugging hippie without the need to drive a Prius.

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CitroJim
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by CitroJim » 04 Jan 2018, 16:30

Interesting on both the early sumps and on running an ES9J4 on E85...

The ECU and fuel system must have plenty in reserve which goes along with my thinking that the ES9J4 was very conservatively rated and good for rather more than its 194hp...

wurlycorner
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by wurlycorner » 04 Jan 2018, 21:30

Only just read this thread...

Buying a V6 Activa for a sensible daily?
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xantia_v6
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by xantia_v6 » 04 Jan 2018, 21:37

I am sceptical that you could get reasonable performance from an unmodified ES9J4 running on E85. I believe that I can tell the difference when running E10 (at least when the engine is cold and running in open-loop mode).

You can of course fir a higher pressure fuel regulator to get a bit more fuel flowing, I have a 3.5 bar regulator in my XM (for running E10), but it does make the trip computer inaccurate.

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 05 Jan 2018, 16:27

E10 is also lower octane fuel, right? At least over here the options are 95 E10 and 98 E5. The latter is certainly better for the ES9J4 because of the octane rating.

E85 is 106 octane, so it shouldn't hinder performance unless the injectors run out of capacity. I have a 3.5 bar fpr ready to be installed, but the difference in injector flow will be only about 10cc, so that alone won't be enough for E85.

I asked about the E85 use in Facebook's Xantia Activa group (where the most ppl seem to be French nowadays). There was a guy who has driven his -97 V6 Activa for almost 30.000km on E85 without any modifications. He even had fueling logs showing average fuel consumption at 11.79l / 100km (about 20mpg I think), which isn't bad at all for ethanol. My Mini Cooper S drinks 12.5l / 100km of E85 on average. :D

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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by RichardW » 06 Jan 2018, 08:49

I think it's the energy density rather than the Octane rating that is the problem - to get the same amount of bang you need put more in. Putting in a higher pressure regulator fools the ECU as it flows more in the same time, but if you want to get the full effect you probably need to re-map the ECU.

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Koukku
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Re: Activated V6 driver

Post by Koukku » 07 Jan 2018, 13:37

Yes, energy density is the reason why you need to put in ~30% more compared to gasoline. But when that requirement is satisfied there really shouldn't be any real world difference in power output. And the ECU adds that fueling for you based on the Lambda signal. Or at least the ES9J4 ECU does. Most fuel injected cars will throw a fault code when the ECU is asked to increase (or decrease) fueling more than 20%, because they'll think there's something wrong with fuel delivery.

With a re-map you could get a few extra hp with E85 (in a non-aspirated engine) if the engine's igntion map has been knock limited with gasoline. And of course cold start issues could be addressed with a re-map.